Each student must write his/her O.Q.Q as a post on the HeLa Discussion blog.
Then, each student must claim another student's O.Q.Q to respond to, answer or analyze. Next, each student must post her or his response t the O.Q.Q in the blog
Everyone will be assessed both on her/his O.Q.Q. and on his/her response. Strong responses will be thoughtful, fully articulated, and useful for the class's understanding of the material. See Assessment Rubric.
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ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"Though no law or code of ethics required doctors to ask permission before taking tissue from a living patient, the law made it very clear that performing an autopsy or removing tissue from the dead without permission was illegal"
ReplyDelete"'I don't want to cause problems for science,' Sonny told me as this book went to press. 'Dale wouldn't want that. And besides, I'm proud of my mother and what she done for science. I just hope Hopkins and some of the other folks who benefited off her cells will do something to honor her and make right with the family" Page 328 - Sonny Lacks, Henrietta Lacks' Son
ReplyDeleteIf would be one of the Lacks family, I would probably demand on a financial benefit such as a "copyright" for her cells. It´s sick that they are not getting any compensation.
DeleteQuote:
ReplyDelete"Like I’m always telling my brothers, if you gonna go into history, you can’t do it with a hate attitude. You got to remember, times was different." - Deborah, Henrietta Lacks' younger daughter
Observations:
ReplyDelete“The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks” by Rebecca Skloot incorporates various themes that perfectly portray society at that time. The book is a great one to be studied from a biological perspective, however the Lacks’ story also shows the struggles the family had to face since the 1950s. Most of Henrietta’s children suffer from different kinds of abuse during their lifetime, such as Deborah, Zakariyya (Joe), and Elsie. This shows that child abuse was probably common during those years, or at least much more common than nowadays. Deborah and Zakariyya didn’t only suffer from child abuse, but also suffer from domestic abuse. Deborah suffers from sexual and physical abuse by her uncle, Galen, when he moves to the Lacks house. Their aunt, Ethel, also moves to the Lacks house and physically abuses Zakariyya, something that deeply influences him and is probably the main cause of his aggressive behaviour when he grows older, finally leading to becoming a criminal. Elsie is also abused at Crownsville State Hospital, she is mistreated and is subject of cruel experiments practiced in the facility. Meanwhile she also suffers from abusive care in the facility, all of this is discovered by Deborah after Elsie’s death at Crownsville State Hospital.
Questions:
ReplyDeleteWould Henrietta’s chance of survival and treatment in the hospital have changed if she was a white American? And how would her family’s situation have changed if they were a white American family?
Yes, the book reports that most of the samples taken were from black people. It would have been much less likely for Henrietta's cells to be taken, especially without her consent. Her family probably would have had more attention, as when the story came out about Henrietta her relatives were dismissed as "poor blacks." There probably would have been more shock and outrage among the general population had the Lacks been white.
DeleteYes, I also believe that if Henrietta had been white, she would have been treated much more cautiously. This is because months before her death, Henrietta complained to the doctos saying she was feeling terribly bad. Nevertheless, doctors did not listen to her, and simply wrote entries in her medical record "no recurrence". However, two weeks later she was declared "inoperable". If Henrietta had been white, doctors would have listened to her complaints and probably would have acted to cure her.
DeleteYes, this book shows many examples of injustice for the black people, as they are always the ones chosen for the research or experimentation for the development of new treatments. If Henrietta would have been a white American, she would have had better treatments and health care, and probably would had a better chance of surviving. Doctors would have helped her whenever she needed help and try their best to save her. Also, if her family would have been white American, they would have had good qualified health care.
DeleteI strongly believe that the outcome of Henrietta's cancer situation could have ended much better if it was the case of a white woman. The book gives solid evidence about the little effort doctors showed when treating black patients. When the doctors saw the fast pace by which Henrietta's cancer developed they saw the opportunity to stop the treatment and stop waisting time on what they considered to be an inferior person. If she would have been a white patient doctors would have tried more treatments and maybe practice new procedures on her in order to try and cure the cancer.
DeleteIf the family had been white there would have also been a huge difference with the treatment they were exposed to. Doctors would have been much more cautious with Henrietta's family after her death and they may have asked for permission when extracting the tissue from her body. The family would have been much more informed about the HeLa situation and they could have had more opportunities to share the income and prestige with those companies selling HeLa cells.
My answer will be yes, in the novel it specifies that all the cell samples they were using were from Afro-American people. I think according to the information given in the book that if Henrietta was white, she will definitely be less likely to undergo this types of treatments and the removal of her cells. Also in the book it said that they did not ask her if they could do that, so her consent was not even present in the whole study. I believe that if HeLa would have been white non of this rough treatments could have been performed. (Like the Radio implant!!!). All the doctors in the hospital gave little effort when they were treating "poor blacks". In fact, I remember reading about when she was felling sick and ask the doctors what was happening to her, they did not even care about it.
DeleteQuotations:
ReplyDelete“Black scientists and technicians, many of them women, used cells from a black woman to help save the lives of millions of Americans, most of them white.”
This quote portrays how black men and women were starting to be accepted at jobs but the products were then used on white Americans showing racism was still present in the American society.
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ReplyDeleteQuote:
ReplyDelete“Doctors say they never heard of another case like Henri-etta’s! I’m sure it was either man-made or spirit-made, one of the two.”
Question:
ReplyDeleteAfter the Tuskegee Syphilis study, “the U.S. government promised to give lifetime medical benefits to and burial services to all participants. […] In 1975, wives, widows and offspring were added to the program. […] There are 12 offspring currently medical and health benefits.” The victims of the Tuskegee Syphilis Study, even though helping with the creation of the treatment, did not receive any personal treatment for themselves. Thus, since their relatives and them received medical aid from the U.S. government due to the aforementioned issue, wouldn’t it be fair for the Lacks family to also receive medical aid from the government? (Seen as their mother helped greatly with advances of medicine and wasn’t informed of this, similarly to the Tuskegee Study.)
If we were to follow this logic, then yes, the Lacks should receive medical aid from the U.S. But that is not how we should be thinking. As I said in my observation, all American citizens should have the right to healthcare, regardless of their economic status.
DeleteI agree with Nolan's response.
DeleteI think the Lacks family and all the afro-american community in that time should have receive medical aid form the U.S. All the people should have this right. Because if not people would be in the street nearly dying and spreading diseases which is a huge issue in non-develop countries. For example when I lived in Argentina, in my school we gathered money for people who were not able to have healthcare and this continues to happen in many countries, and the U.S is included in one of those. All people in the world should have free healthcare and education.
See this interesting link that I had just found:
Deletehttp://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Debate:Should_a_just_government_provide_healthcare_to_its_citizens%3F
Obeservation:
ReplyDeleteThroughout the novel I found the Lacks family in general quite fascinating. However, as I was reading, something bugged me. Whenever the Lackses were asked about Henrietta, they all talked about cells as if they had been aware of the concept all their lives. I found this quite surprising, as they Lackses are not highly educated, and it seemed bizarre to me that they were able to throw the word “cell” around so easily and seamlessly. At first, I assumed that some scientist or other had explained the concept to them and continued on with my reading without giving it much thought. However, as I soon discovered that the Lackses actually had no idea what cells are or how they work and, if anything, they only had a basic notion of how those cells used to be part of their ancestor, Henrietta Lacks. This is clearly demonstrated when the author of the novel, Rebecca Skloot, meets the Lacks family in person for the first time in the chapter Night Doctors, as she must explain to them what cells are and how they work. This is seen again when Christoph Lengauer, a scientist at John Hopkins, explains how cells work to Deborah and Zakariyya in the chapter “All That’s My Mother”.
I found this quite shocking for two reasons. The first and, perhaps, the most obvious reason is that, it demonstrates just how uneducated the Lackes are. I always find it rather bizarre to think that a fully grown man or woman could, potentially, be educated on anything by me, a much younger, yet also much more educated individual.
My second observation, however, I find more interesting in terms of the Lackses’s personalities: none of them had ever asked what cells were before then. It could potentially be argued that they did so because they were not interested, but this would be a very misguided statement, as they are clearly eager to learn anything they can about Henrietta, as is demonstrated in their excitement when they first learn about cells and their functions. Therefore, this leaves us with just one more explanation for their behaviour that makes sense to me: the Lackses are embarrassed by their lack of education and ignorance. This does not mean that they are not curious about the world they live in, but they are too afraid of humiliation to ask questions and learn about it. Sadly, these feelings are justified, as they have been trampled with endlessly, both by scientist using Henrietta’s cells and by their own relatives and caretakers. Perhaps acting as if they all know what cells are is a way for them to preserve whatever pride and dignity they can, as much of it has already been stripped away from them. However, this only resulted in their unnecessary ignorance and a great lack of understanding of their own pasts, making it more a mistake than anything else.
I think that we should all learn from the way the Lackses behaved in order to remember that asking questions might seem embarrassing, but it always leads to one’s improvement and helps us stay critical and informed about the world we live in.
Question:
ReplyDeleteWayne Grody stated that he cannot imagine how a functional consent process would work if patients were able to decide what their tissues could be used for, claiming “These tissues enter a pipeline of millions of other samples. How are you to distinguish, well, this patient said we can study colon cancer; the next one said we can do anything we want but we can’t commercialize it. I mean, do they all have to be color-coded?” Can you think of any possible solutions for this issue?
As in the book says, After lots of discussions with Andrews and Clayton, this becomes more moderate. However Grody stresses that questions of consent should be applied to the collection of future examples of cancer cells, He also says that the already collected samples should not be considered.
DeleteRobert Weir, founder of the biomedical ethics center at the University of Iowa, says that there is only one possible outcome. The acknowledgement of all of this patients is the solution. He also creates a legal guideline to prevent this.
Quote:
ReplyDelete“She's the most important person in the world and her family living in poverty. If our mother is so important to science, why can't we get health insurance?” -Lawrence Lacks, The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks.
Nolan Young
ReplyDeleteQuote:
"Truth be told, I can't get mad at science, because it help people live, and I'd be a mess without it. I'm a walking drugstore! I can't say nuthin bad about science, but I won't lie, I would like some health insurance so I don't got to pay all that money every month for drugs my mother cells probably helped make." - Deborah Lacks, "The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks"
Question:
ReplyDelete"Do you think Henrietta's family has more of a right to free healthcare than the rest of the American population?
I think that giving Henrietta's family a right to free healthcare would be slightly utopian. First of all, it depends on what you mean by "family", whether it includes only her husband and children or all her grandchildren and future generations. Also, even though HeLa have significantly contributed to the creation of new treatments or medicines, she is not the only one. Of course, if her family had a right to free healthcare, the families of all those others who have contributed to this field would also have a right to free healthcare, which means that a significant population of the US would also have more of a right to free healthcare.
DeleteNevertheless, I still agree with your observation when you say that all American citizens should have a right to free healthcare.
My opinion is NO!! I think all americans should have the same rights. Everybody should have the same right to free healthcare, as I said before. However, I think HeLA family should be financially benefited, because of their contribution to science and mainly to biomedical issues(new treatments).
DeleteI agree with the previous answers stating that everyone should have the same rights to healthcare.
DeleteHowever, I do not feel that Henrietta's family has any right over the rest of the population. It was Henrietta who made the contribution to science. Had Henrietta survived, I believe SHE should have had the right to healthcare over other people, following the USA healthcare system's actions in situations like this. However, her family did not add anything to science, it was their mother, therefore I believe that her family has no privilege over the rest of the population.
In an "ideal" world, obviously, and what we should strive to achieve, is that everyone has healthcare. I belive that there should be no differentiation over people who have contributed voluntarily or involuntarily to science, as the access to healthcare is a basic human right.
Observation:
ReplyDeleteOne of the biggest problems for the Lacks family is its poverty, and therefore, lack of access to healthcare. In the United States, there is no functioning public healthcare system. In 2009, the U.S. had the highest healthcare costs relative to the size of its GDP in the world. And yet, there are thousands of people who have no access to healthcare.
Most European countries have universal health coverage, which is really beneficial for European citizens. A family like the Lacks in Europe would have access to healthcare. This healthcare is funded by public taxation, and it really works. Why doesn't the U.S. adopt this strategy also? Other developed countries such as Canada and Australia also use this system.
In my opinion, it shouldn't be that the Lacks get healthcare because their relative Henrietta changed science with her cells. They should get it because it should be their right. Every American citizen, rich or poor, should have the right to healthcare.
America is behind on too many issues: the Conservative, right-wing party in the UK would be considered a very left-wing party in the U.S. We're not living in the 18th century, as many Republicans would like to believe.
Observation:
ReplyDeleteOne of the many discoveries that HeLa led to where the human-animal hybrids done by somatic cell fusion. This allowed scientists to map the human genes and to start working on the idea of gene therapy. When this took place, numerous articles were published with headlines such as "Man-animal cells are bred in lab", "The next step could be tree men" or "scientists create monsters". These misleading articles caused huge arguments, with the public going against scientists.
Although many scientists tried to defend their work by reassuring the public that "they were just creating cells, not trying to produce centaurs", there was no going back, and people started claiming that this "was an example of men trying to be gods".
Some years later, the human genome was decoded and everything thanks to these scientists who began experimenting with human-animal hybrid cells, who had been severely judged and criticized by various magazines/ newspapers as well as by the public. Simply because they did not understand what was really going on, the press panicked, and therefore, so did everyone else.
I think that this is an example of a situation extremely unfair for those scientists who devote their lives to the purpose of finding out about humans or treatments for our many severe deseases. In my opinion, the press should be aware of the damage they can cause in society. They should think about whether what they are writing is really true, or they are just exaggerating something. Also, I believe that those who simply dislike science or don't understand it should not be allowed to write about this type os experiments since they may actually end up becoming one of the many obstacles that science must overcome.
Quote:
ReplyDelete"The tribunal set forth a ten.point code of ethics now known as the Nuremberg Code, which was to govern all human experimentation worldwide. The first line in that the code says, "The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential." The idea was revolutionary. (...) But the Nuremberg Code- like other codes that would come after it- wasn't law"
Question:
ReplyDeleteHenrietta's family didn't have access to good education, especially in the science field. Do you think that if they had understood better how much the HeLa cells contributed to the science field, they would have had a different attitude towards the people who actually used these cells and earned money from them?
As I talked about in my observation, I think that the Lackses' level of education had a huge impact on their personalities and lives. Of course, if they had been better informed about what cells are and how scientists used Henrietta's, their opinions on the matter of how these were used would obviously be different, as they would be better informed. In turn, this would allow them to produce a more critical and well thought-out opinion on the matter. In addition to this, knowing more about the science behind cells and how they can be used in scientific investigation would have also saved the Lacks family a lot of unnecessary confusion and fear, as the vague and abstract notion of what was happening to their ancestor would have been replaced with facts and concrete knowledge. After all, people are said to fear what they don't know, so being better scientifically educated would have saved them a lot of fear.
DeleteThis just goes to show the pivotal role of education when it comes to constructing a critical, informed and rational society.
I actually disagree with Ainhoa. I believe Henrietta's family would have had the same attitude towards the people who used the cells. Even if they knew how the HeLa cells would contribute to the science field, Henrietta's rights were violated. Scientists experimented on her cells without her concent and the scientists were earning money for stealing a woman's cells illegaly, meanwhile Henrietta's family struggled to live their life. So, although educaion is education is the pivotal role to construct a critical, informed and rational society, I believe it doesn't apply in this case. Henrietta's rights were violated and being scientifically educated wouldn't have change that.
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ReplyDeleteQuote:
ReplyDelete"Like many doctors of his era, TeLinde often used patients from the public wards for research, usually without their knowledge. Many scientists believed that since patients were treated for free in the public wards, it was fair to use them as research subjects as a form of payment."
Question:
ReplyDeleteWere there any moments throughout Rebecca's research were the privacy or intimacy of the lacks family was violated or interrupted. And Did the Lacks family find the outcome of the HeLa situation "satisfactory"
Observations:
ReplyDeleteThe thing that struck me the most of this book was the disrespect and the lack of morality that medical attendants and researches portrayed when treating colored patients and their families. Now a days its hard to imagine a doctor extracting a body tissue from a patient before reporting the family about the extraction. This was the opposite that happened to Henrietta. Extracting a tissue from a colored patient was compared as extracting one out of an animal. Which is completely ridiculous. Not only did The doctor extract that tissue without any consent but he then made profit from it and didn't share the money with the family who's mother opened the doors of research and health development. I feel relieved that at least there is a book which talks about this issues and shows the world how cruel and selfish human beings can bee with each other.
Quote:
ReplyDelete" One afternoon, as Henrietta lay on the couch, she lifted her shirt to show Margaret and Sadie what the treatments had done to her. Sadie gasped: The skin from Henrietta's breasts to her pelvis was charred a deep black from the radiation. " Page 48, "The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks"
Question:
ReplyDelete¿Did Deborah’s feelings and fears change after finding out that her mother’s cells were still alive?
Observation:
ReplyDeleteThe biography “The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks”, by Rebecca Skloot impacted me in many ways. It talked about all the suffering of Henrietta and her family, all the moral and ethical issues, racism and how did HeLa cells actually help to science and investigation in some way. However, a lot of research and experimentation went into the development of the first immortal cells. HeLa cells helped on the progress of new sterilization processes, cell food, cloning, gene mapping, developing the polio vaccine, secrets of cancers, viruses and the atoms bomb’s effects etc… and all came from Gey’s lab, which finally made a huge importance of HeLa in medical research and the development of new treatments.
Quote:
ReplyDelete"Henrietta's were different, they reproduced entire generation every 24 hours, and they never stopped. They became the first immortal human cells ever grown in a laboratory."
Question:
ReplyDeleteWhere do you think would we be now in science without HeLa's cells?
I think we will be more or less behind from we are know, but not much. However, I think they have made great contribution to biomedical research and development. And lots of new treatments and medicines have been created since they were discovered.
DeleteQuote:
ReplyDelete"But first—though no one had told Henrietta that TeLinde was collecting sample or asked she wanted to be a donor—Wharton picked up a sharp knife and shaved two dine-sized pieces of tissue from Henrietta's cervix: one from her tumor, and one from the healthy cervical tissue nearby. Then he placed the samples in a glass dish."
Question:
ReplyDeleteConsidering the continuation of Henrietta’s cancer in her last 8 months between the diagnosis and the day of her death. How did she face everything until the day of her death? What does that say about the type of person Henrietta was?
As we know, from the moment she was diagnosed with cancer, to the day of her death, she tried to keep on with her life. She accepted the fact that she had cancer, but she didn´t give up or lose hope. She had faith and believed she would be cured. She never lost hope, she would continue on with her life, and visit the hospital for treatments. Even when those treatments started to worsen her state, she always tried to have hope and fight the cancer. This gives us great insight on who she really was, a strong woman, willing to fight until the end to remain with her family. In my opinion she was an incredible woman, that fought cancer for eight months and never lost hope.
DeleteObservation:
ReplyDeleteHenrietta Lacks had five children; Lawrence, Elsie, Sonny, Deborah and Zakariyya. One of them, Elsie, was born with severe development delays and as well couldn’t hear or speak. She was also affected by epilepsy. Due to this she was sent to Crownsville, also known as “Hospital for the Negro Insane of Maryland”. There she spent about 5 years from age 10 to 15, along with almost 2,700 patients. She was only visited by her mother, until she developed the cancer and stopped visiting her. Then she was forgotten and her family only remembered of her existence upon her death.
At the time of Elsie´s death, Crownsville was overcrowded, with about 1 doctor for every 225 patients. This overcrowding led to curable patients being “lost”. As well, a significant number of patients were completely sane and suffered no apparent illness.
Quotation:
“That was the last time she would see her daughter—Emmett figures she knew she was saying goodbye. What she dint know was that no one would ever visit Elsie again.”
Question:
If Crownsville had been a mental institute for white people and Elsie had been white, would she have survived? Would the conditions given in Crownsville during the fifties (overcrowding and lack of treatment) have occurred too at mental hospitals for white people?
I do believe Elsie would have survived if she was a white girl and treated in a white insitution. Mental istitutions for white people probably had better material and more professionals in the field. In Crownsville, patients suffered from cruel experimentation, something that did NOT happen in insitutions for white people where the conditions would have been far better. Mental insitutions for white people were probably larger and with more employees so overcrowding and lack of treatment would probably not be an issue, leading to a much lower death rate than in institutions for black people such as Crownsville.
DeleteI would say that we don't have enough information about Elsie's situation to know for sure whether she would have survived. However, what I do agree with is that had Elsie been white, her situation would have been better and she would have probably received a better treatment. However, at that time treatments for mentally ill people were not very developed, so this would have bought her a few years, but not such a long life to get to know her sister Deborah.
DeleteObviously, the conditions at Crownsville hospital during the fifties would have not occurred in white hospitals. Racism at this time was extreme, as can be seen in the book, so mental hospitals for white people would have probably been much more privileged and would have had better resources to treat mentally ill people.
Observation:
ReplyDeleteEthical issues have to be considered in Henrietta's case. As you know, her cells were taken withour her consent when she was being treated from her cancer. This cells continued to reproduce, they were immortal. However, there is something beyond this which has no sense. Henrietta's cells have been bought and sold all around the world. This cells have helped to save a big number of lives, and still, Henrietta's family could never afford health insurance despite suffering from chronical ilnesses. Henrietta's cells were taken in 1951, but it wasn't until 1971 that her family knew that her cells existed and were being used around the world, without knowing until very recent times, what the researchers did with her cells and how they used them. How can that be possible?
Question:Is there any update to the story of HeLa and the Lacks family since the book was published? Has anything new happened to the family in relation to HeLa?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/24/opinion/sunday/the-immortal-life-of-henrietta-lacks-the-sequel.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
Probably want to look at this!!!!!!
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ReplyDeleteIf the cells of HeLa had been so important to science for years, What would have happened if HeLa had not been born?
ReplyDeleteOBSERVATION: What caught my attention of this book was that, if Henrietta lacks had a cancer, and then those cells when she died continued reproducing. Those cells after were used to help other people and they helped improving the science. When she was alive, was not famous but when she died, HeLa's family and everybody began to know and learn about the fabulous history of The inmortal life on henrietta lacks
ReplyDeleteObservation:
ReplyDeleteSomething I have found shocking as I read this book is the importance that the Lacks family, especially Deborah, give to religion. It can be observed that at the end of the book, when they go to church and Rebecca is asked to speak, Deborah is immersed in her speech. Also, when Deborah and Rebecca go to visit Deborah's cousing Gary, and Deborah starts crying, Gary gives her words of comfort, alluding to the Bible, such as in the quote:
"Like the Bible said,' Gary whispered, 'man brought nothing into this world and he'll carry nothing out. Sometimes we care about stuff too much. We worry when there's nothing to worry about.Some things you got to release. Gary said. The more you hold them in, the worse you get. When you release them, they got to go somewhere else. The Bible says He can carry all that burden."
I find that Deborah's faith is one of the points that makes her strong enough to endure all the issues that revolve around her mother and family. Although her brother, Zakariyya, becomes a Muslim, he also finds comfort in that religion. Therefore, I find that each person's faith helps them cope with the problem of their mother and supports them.
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ReplyDeleteQuestion:
ReplyDeleteWhat does HeLa's family current situation say about the struggle in America for universal healthcare? Furthermore, what leads such a majority of Americans to think that it'll be hurtful for the country?
I think we already answer this question like 4 times in the blog. Read above for the response.
DeleteObservation: One thing that interested me in the book was the presence of paternalism in the doctor-patient paradigm. It meant that the doctor always—always—knew what was best for the patient. This meant that he (rarely she) could make decisions about treatment without taking the patient into account. The doctor could withhold information if he pleased or if it would be upsetting. Basically if the situation would make things more complicated for the doctor, he would've stay indifferent and don't mention anything. This idea of paternalism, in both medical and research contexts, is an important motif in the book.
ReplyDeleteObservation: There are a plethora of ethical issues represented in HeLa book. According to the narrative since 1951, the field of science and technology have advanced much faster than before and our society have develop many ways to figure out what is right and what is wrong about tissue cultures. In the 1980s doctors removed cancer to a man called John Moore, after they patented some of his cells to create an enterprise which is now valued in $3 billion, without John Moore´s consent. After this Moore went to court and claimed that patients should have rights of controlling their own tissues, however, California Supreme Court bring down the case and said that the tissue removed from his body had been abandoned as a medical leftovers.
ReplyDeleteDo you think this is fair?